Ian Robertson - Classic Retro Modern Magazine: Simca, Talbot, Peugeot, Ford Sierra and collecting car brochures. S5E4

[00:00:00] Welcome to My Dads Car, enjoy!

[00:00:12] Welcome to My Dads Car, a podcast discussing our personal relationship with automotive nostalgia.

[00:00:18] And you know what? It doesn't even have to be about your dad's car. It can be your mum's, your grand's, your parents, guardians or even a neighbour's.

[00:00:26] If it made an impression, let's talk about it.

[00:00:34] Hello. Hiya. How are we doing?

[00:00:36] Alright, yeah. Can we all hear and see each other?

[00:00:38] Yes, indeed. Yeah. That's a treat.

[00:00:40] I almost started this without a microphone in my nose.

[00:00:43] Really?

[00:00:44] Of course I do.

[00:00:45] Wouldn't be the first time.

[00:00:47] Well, yeah, this is very efficient.

[00:00:49] Yeah.

[00:00:50] Welcome along to the fun, Ian.

[00:00:52] Thank you very much.

[00:00:53] You alright Ian?

[00:00:53] Yeah, we will make a start.

[00:00:56] For the benefit of the tape, we're joined by Ian from Classic Retro Modern.

[00:01:00] Have I got that right?

[00:01:02] That's it.

[00:01:02] Yep, that's right.

[00:01:03] It's the Car Magazine. Do you want to give us a quick backstory on it?

[00:01:06] What's the...

[00:01:07] I'm obviously personally growing up pre-internet.

[00:01:10] I was quite a fan of the Car Magazine.

[00:01:12] So, yeah, good to have you here telling us about that.

[00:01:15] Thank you very much.

[00:01:16] Yeah, we were really a product of the lockdown really.

[00:01:20] Where a few journo mates got together, thought that we could probably do the Classic Car Magazine.

[00:01:27] Something that we want to really read ourselves.

[00:01:30] Yeah.

[00:01:30] Rather than the stuff already out there.

[00:01:33] And so, four of us got together and put together this magazine.

[00:01:37] We found a designer that is just as passionate about cars as us.

[00:01:41] And so, we kind of got the dream team.

[00:01:43] So, she's been available since July 2001.

[00:01:47] Oh wow.

[00:01:47] Okay.

[00:01:48] No.

[00:01:48] 2021.

[00:01:51] I was going to say.

[00:01:53] 2021.

[00:01:54] And we're on issue 28 at the moment.

[00:01:57] 29 goes to print very shortly.

[00:01:59] So, life's very busy.

[00:02:01] We've moved from a monthly schedule to a bi-monthly schedule.

[00:02:04] Okay.

[00:02:05] And we're just about to launch some books as well, which is good.

[00:02:08] Excellent.

[00:02:08] Is that in Tesco's WH Smith, et cetera?

[00:02:11] Is it subscription only or...?

[00:02:12] Yeah.

[00:02:13] The magazine's in WH Smith's, all news agents up and down the country.

[00:02:18] Okay.

[00:02:18] So, the book is available via website.

[00:02:22] Sort of turn the water exercise, see how it goes down.

[00:02:25] And yeah, we haven't advertised it at all yet, but we've already sold about 15% of our run already.

[00:02:33] So, that's pretty good going.

[00:02:35] Nice.

[00:02:35] Fantastic.

[00:02:36] And what's the sort of eras that you cover?

[00:02:39] We start 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s, and we run up to about 2005.

[00:02:45] Okay.

[00:02:45] And as time goes on, that will be a moving date, but about a 20-year gap where we don't feature the cars.

[00:02:53] Yeah, yeah.

[00:02:54] So, yeah.

[00:02:55] It's quite a variety from someone that I must admit, as far as I'm concerned, cars didn't really start in the 70s until I was born.

[00:03:04] So, yeah.

[00:03:05] I love it.

[00:03:06] Fantastic.

[00:03:07] Yeah.

[00:03:08] We'll throw the big one at you.

[00:03:09] What's your earliest car memory?

[00:03:11] I think it's my dad's cars, really.

[00:03:14] I grew up in Torbett Horizons.

[00:03:16] There are three of them.

[00:03:17] My mum had a Chrysler Sunbeam, and there was those.

[00:03:21] Going back a little bit further, we had Simcas.

[00:03:24] So, it was all those type of cars.

[00:03:27] Okay.

[00:03:27] And then my dad worked out in Saudi for about six years, came back and had to buy his own car, and I told him,

[00:03:33] you've got to buy a Peugeot 405 because I want to buy it from you.

[00:03:35] That's my first car.

[00:03:36] And I did.

[00:03:37] That's awesome.

[00:03:38] So, that was my first car.

[00:03:39] So, I'm a bit of a French car fan, Peugeot, Citroen, that sort of thing.

[00:03:43] Yeah, yeah.

[00:03:44] But I'm also a big fan of MG and Rover and that sort of stuff.

[00:03:47] So, did you grow up in Saudi Arabia?

[00:03:49] No, no, no.

[00:03:51] My dad just worked out there.

[00:03:52] He worked for Ministry of Defence and Aramco.

[00:03:55] So, he was out there for six years.

[00:03:57] We were in England.

[00:03:58] So, all good.

[00:04:00] Did it take much persuasion, Ian, for him to get the 405?

[00:04:03] Well, it did at first because he was looking for, he wanted an escort gear.

[00:04:08] Right.

[00:04:09] And then I said to him, let's go and have a look.

[00:04:11] And so, we went to the Peugeot garage and he didn't like the 405 at first because he

[00:04:16] said the rear view wasn't very good.

[00:04:18] But he was sitting in the showroom and he was right up in the corner.

[00:04:21] So, it wasn't very good.

[00:04:22] Hmm.

[00:04:22] And he'd set his mind, okay, well, I'll have a 309 SRI.

[00:04:26] Nice.

[00:04:27] So, we did that and the garage wasn't very good.

[00:04:29] So, he went to the one he used to buy Simcas from in Romford and he saw a 405 and he said,

[00:04:35] oh, I really like that one.

[00:04:36] And I said, well, that's what you just sat in at Southend and said you didn't like.

[00:04:40] And by the end of it, he'd bought it.

[00:04:42] Nice.

[00:04:42] What colour was it?

[00:04:43] Maybe it was the colour that threw him.

[00:04:44] Cherry red.

[00:04:46] Like half of them were.

[00:04:47] Yeah.

[00:04:47] GL 1.9.

[00:04:48] So, that was eventually my first car.

[00:04:51] Whereas most of my mates were in 1.1 Fiestas.

[00:04:54] I was in a 1.9 Peugeot.

[00:04:56] So, I tended to drive because I had the space.

[00:04:59] I was going to say, that's a big old boat, isn't it, for a first car?

[00:05:02] It was.

[00:05:03] And yet, I only needed to work about five miles up the road.

[00:05:06] So, 10 miles a day I was doing.

[00:05:09] And in the first year of owning the car, I'd done 25,000 miles.

[00:05:14] Wow.

[00:05:14] Because you should drive everywhere.

[00:05:16] Back when fuel was very, very cheap.

[00:05:18] Yeah.

[00:05:19] I think it was 37p a litre back then.

[00:05:22] Goodness.

[00:05:23] All those years ago.

[00:05:24] So, if we go back to the Talbot Horizons, etc.

[00:05:27] Were your parents buying these new?

[00:05:29] Was it a company car for your father or maybe for your mum?

[00:05:32] Yeah.

[00:05:33] My dad's first one was a red 1.3 LS and that was a company car.

[00:05:39] Then he got a Horizon Special, which was black with silver stripes down the side,

[00:05:44] a bit like a Lotus Sunbeam.

[00:05:45] Okay.

[00:05:46] He really loved that car.

[00:05:48] And then he went to work for relative and family business.

[00:05:51] So, he got a Horizon again as a company car at GLX.

[00:05:55] So, yeah.

[00:05:56] He had three of those.

[00:05:58] And then after that, they were all privately owned.

[00:06:01] Hmm.

[00:06:01] Was it...

[00:06:02] I don't know whether you'd know it, obviously.

[00:06:04] I guess in the circles you move, was it considered a bit of a risk or a lifestyle choice to kind of go down the surprise of Sunbeam route when obviously British Leyland was so obvious?

[00:06:12] I guess Ford was so obvious.

[00:06:14] Yeah.

[00:06:15] Yeah.

[00:06:15] I think my dad always liked to have something a bit different.

[00:06:18] Hmm.

[00:06:19] So, when he got his first Simca, he applied for a job.

[00:06:23] And on the application, the woman says, do you drive?

[00:06:26] And he put yes.

[00:06:27] And he hadn't got a driving license.

[00:06:29] And so, he had to pass his test to prove that he wasn't lying on the job application.

[00:06:34] And luckily he did.

[00:06:35] And that was what he got given as a company car.

[00:06:37] So, a Simca 1301 saloon.

[00:06:39] And then he got another one.

[00:06:41] He got a 1501.

[00:06:42] And yeah.

[00:06:43] So, I think it...

[00:06:45] Yeah.

[00:06:45] I think it was in his blood really.

[00:06:47] Yeah.

[00:06:47] Something slightly quirky, slightly different.

[00:06:49] Yeah.

[00:06:50] But we had all kinds of cars because my mum and dad got divorced.

[00:06:54] So, he was living in the Cotswolds.

[00:06:56] So, he would come down and pick us up every other weekend.

[00:06:59] The mileage he was putting on the car was ridiculous.

[00:07:01] He was doing 50,000 miles a year.

[00:07:03] Wow.

[00:07:03] So, the car used to get changed quite frequently.

[00:07:06] Yeah.

[00:07:06] Yeah.

[00:07:06] So, we went through a series of Rover SD1s as well.

[00:07:10] And we had loads of Escort gears, Granada gear, MG Maestro.

[00:07:16] We even had an Austin Ambassador, which was pretty terrible.

[00:07:21] But yeah.

[00:07:21] I remember we had a Sierra 1.6L when the Sierras very first came out.

[00:07:26] In fact, I don't think I'd seen another one anywhere.

[00:07:28] And my dad had got one.

[00:07:30] Oh, okay.

[00:07:30] Yeah.

[00:07:30] With the Louvre front grill.

[00:07:33] And it was really, really unusual compared to Cortina's at the time.

[00:07:36] First sort of rounded Ford, wasn't it, I suppose?

[00:07:40] Yeah.

[00:07:41] Yeah, very much so.

[00:07:42] With the door mirrors that sort of looked like they were hanging on a bit of plastic.

[00:07:48] And yeah, we had some very unusual cars, really.

[00:07:50] But he got to the point sometimes when he was changing them every three months.

[00:07:54] Wow.

[00:07:54] Because the mileage was racking up so fast that he was having to do that to keep the value in them.

[00:07:59] It's interesting you mentioned the Ford Sierra, actually.

[00:08:01] Obviously, it was a bit of a groundbreaker.

[00:08:03] But if you think of other Fords that have come out which sort of shook things up a little bit,

[00:08:07] the KA and then the Focus as well were kind of, when they came out,

[00:08:11] they were definitely divided opinion, didn't they, with regards to their styling?

[00:08:14] Oh, yes.

[00:08:15] So, yeah, obviously the Sierra would have done the same as you compare it to, say, the Cortina or the Granada as well.

[00:08:22] Yeah.

[00:08:22] I can remember when the KA very first came out,

[00:08:25] I had somebody reversed in front of my Mondeo and they gave me one as a courtesy car.

[00:08:29] Okay.

[00:08:30] And I was driving into work and there were people pointing at the car laughing.

[00:08:35] And I said to one of my colleagues…

[00:08:37] Sorry about that.

[00:08:38] Yeah.

[00:08:39] I said to her, people are laughing at my car.

[00:08:42] And she said, no, no.

[00:08:43] So we went up to the high street at lunchtime and she witnessed it.

[00:08:46] And people were pointing and ridiculing the thing.

[00:08:49] But in the end, it all came good because it was an absolutely brilliant little car.

[00:08:54] It had so much space in it.

[00:08:55] You still see quite a few of those about, aren't you?

[00:08:57] The original KAs.

[00:08:58] Yeah.

[00:08:59] Yeah.

[00:09:00] If they haven't rusted around where the fuel filler is, that's where they usually fail their MOT first.

[00:09:06] Yeah.

[00:09:06] But yeah, when you think it first went on sale in 1995, 96.

[00:09:10] Wow.

[00:09:11] Was it really that long ago?

[00:09:12] I thought it was…

[00:09:13] Yeah.

[00:09:13] Wow, that's incredible.

[00:09:14] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:09:15] I don't know why in my mind I had sort of early 2000s, but…

[00:09:18] P-registration was the first one.

[00:09:19] Was it?

[00:09:20] Yes.

[00:09:20] Yeah.

[00:09:21] And then they innovatively named them 1, 2 and 3.

[00:09:26] They've already called it car.

[00:09:28] That was pretty boring.

[00:09:29] Well, yeah.

[00:09:29] It's like calling your dog, dog, isn't it?

[00:09:31] It was actually the full car.

[00:09:33] Yeah.

[00:09:33] That was what it was supposed to be.

[00:09:36] But, K-A, car, everything.

[00:09:38] It used to get called everything.

[00:09:39] 1, 2, 3.

[00:09:40] We've only got the meeting room for half an hour, guys.

[00:09:42] Let's just…

[00:09:45] Yes.

[00:09:46] I like it.

[00:09:47] The sport car and the street car and…

[00:09:49] They had a radio DJ on their ideas panel and he started with 1, 2.

[00:09:53] Yeah.

[00:09:56] Yes.

[00:09:57] But, uh, great little car.

[00:09:59] So, um, who was in the car?

[00:10:00] You got brothers and sisters or…?

[00:10:02] I've got brothers and sisters, yeah.

[00:10:03] I've got quite a big family, really, because I've got, uh, I've got my sister and the same

[00:10:07] dad.

[00:10:08] Then I've got a stepbrother and a stepsister and, yeah, it goes out from there.

[00:10:12] Where do you think your love of cars comes from, Ian?

[00:10:14] Is it your dad?

[00:10:15] Uh, my dad reckoned my first word was car.

[00:10:19] Or car.

[00:10:19] Yeah.

[00:10:20] Or K-A.

[00:10:21] From day one.

[00:10:22] But, uh, my dad always recounts the story where, um, mum and dad had been to, uh, B-Jams,

[00:10:29] which was like the Iceland of the, uh, 1970s.

[00:10:32] Okay.

[00:10:32] So they parked the car in the driveway and they'd gone in to pack the freezer with the

[00:10:37] food, left us in the car, and I'd managed to get the, uh, handbrake off the car and steer

[00:10:43] the car through the gate and out into the road.

[00:10:47] And my dad always said that he had enough trouble doing it without scraping the car.

[00:10:51] And yet there's a sort of three or four year old that has managed to do it and drive it and

[00:10:55] steer it without crashing it at all.

[00:10:57] That young, I was managing to, uh, to drive a car quite well.

[00:11:01] Natural.

[00:11:01] What car was that?

[00:11:02] That was a Simca.

[00:11:03] Okay.

[00:11:03] Yeah.

[00:11:04] No, I just love cars.

[00:11:06] Always collected car brochures and I've got probably about 80,000.

[00:11:09] So, uh, yeah.

[00:11:11] So I've got over half a double garage full of, uh, car brochures that I'm gradually trying

[00:11:16] to sell now.

[00:11:17] How long have you been divorced?

[00:11:18] Yeah.

[00:11:20] So it's, and being in the business that I am, I'm a manager of a modern car magazine

[00:11:25] as well.

[00:11:26] So you just get given press packs and brochures and things like that.

[00:11:30] So I've got, as well as the half a double garage, I've got another room full and, uh,

[00:11:35] I'm probably one of the original people that started saving PDFs when they very first started

[00:11:40] coming out.

[00:11:41] Whereas most people haven't got, um, brochures and things like that.

[00:11:44] As soon as the, the prinzy version stopped being produced, I've got, I've got everything.

[00:11:48] So I've got, uh, I think about 50,000 PDFs as well.

[00:11:51] Right.

[00:11:51] As a reference point, they're invaluable.

[00:11:54] They really are for writing the used car buyers guides and things like that.

[00:11:57] So it's your, um, project that you started during the COVID era.

[00:12:01] Is that now taking up sort of your full time sort of resources or use?

[00:12:06] No, not so much really, because I, I don't get involved in the writing, the magazine.

[00:12:10] I'm more of the back office stuff.

[00:12:12] So I act to the publisher.

[00:12:14] I look after all the subscriptions, the distribution, the circulation, that sort of thing.

[00:12:19] Yeah.

[00:12:20] Um, finance team.

[00:12:21] I do, I do all that side of things where I leave Gavin's the editor.

[00:12:25] He's a absolutely brilliant.

[00:12:27] He took over as editor a few months ago.

[00:12:29] And then we've got Roy, who's the designer who is so much more than the designer because

[00:12:34] he's just so passionate about old cars as well.

[00:12:37] Fantastic.

[00:12:37] It's really the three of us that work together on, on the magazine and it just gels so nicely.

[00:12:42] Hmm.

[00:12:43] Nice.

[00:12:44] Um, do you recall music in the cars?

[00:12:47] Your parents listening to the radio or tapes or?

[00:12:50] Yeah, I don't really remember parents doing it.

[00:12:53] Although the one song I always remember always seemed to be on the radio or on the tape deck

[00:12:58] in the horizon was, um, Roger Whittaker, Durham town.

[00:13:02] Okay.

[00:13:02] That seemed to be the one song my dad always used to be playing.

[00:13:05] But, but when I sort of first had my cars, I bought a six disc auto changer in the boot

[00:13:11] of the car.

[00:13:11] So you'd always had lots of music.

[00:13:13] Yep.

[00:13:13] I just find it bewildering.

[00:13:15] Now you can go out with a phone in your pocket and you've got your entire music collection

[00:13:19] in your pocket compared to what it was years ago.

[00:13:22] So, but yeah, I think ABBA was quite, uh, quite popular in the car and, uh, Brotherhood

[00:13:29] of Man and that sort of thing.

[00:13:31] All sorts of seventies groups.

[00:13:33] Mm.

[00:13:33] War of the Worlds was another one that I could always remember going to sleep to.

[00:13:37] Yeah.

[00:13:37] It's so soothing and you just asleep in the back of the car quite quickly with that.

[00:13:42] Were you doing, um, driving holidays and stuff as kids?

[00:13:45] Didn't do a great deal.

[00:13:46] I think the only one I can remember doing is going down to Cornwall.

[00:13:49] Yeah.

[00:13:49] Um, but because my mum and dad were divorced, we kind of all didn't go on holiday together.

[00:13:55] So I can remember going with my Nan and Granddad and, uh, and down to Cornwall.

[00:13:59] But that was the only one we really did was with my dad.

[00:14:02] We tended to go abroad.

[00:14:04] Fair enough.

[00:14:04] Yeah.

[00:14:05] Yeah.

[00:14:05] No, not really any driving holidays that much, but going back and forth to the Cotswolds

[00:14:10] every other weekend, of course, that was almost like a driving holiday every other weekend,

[00:14:14] really.

[00:14:15] Used to pick us up from school on a Friday.

[00:14:17] Used to head up to the Cotswolds, do what we were doing.

[00:14:20] And then we would be back Sunday night for school again on Monday.

[00:14:24] It was like living two lives really.

[00:14:26] Lived in a lovely little village called Chipping Camden, which is real typical sort of Cotswold

[00:14:31] village.

[00:14:31] And it was just really, really, really lovely.

[00:14:33] It makes you think, doesn't it?

[00:14:35] As my parents split up as well.

[00:14:37] And kind of think the commitment that your parents had to, especially kind of, yeah,

[00:14:41] your dad, if you didn't live with your dad would kind of drive miles and miles, hours

[00:14:44] and hours to kind of come and see you and run you all over.

[00:14:47] And it kind of thinks, I guess as a kid, you take that for granted, don't you?

[00:14:50] Once they've dropped you off and you've got your tea or whatever.

[00:14:53] Yeah.

[00:14:53] And you're off to bed and actually he's got another two hours on the road to go home again.

[00:14:57] And he's got work in the morning.

[00:14:58] Yeah.

[00:14:59] Yeah.

[00:14:59] And as I used to drive quite a lot for work as well.

[00:15:02] So hence why he used to do sort of 50,000 miles a year.

[00:15:05] Yeah.

[00:15:05] But one of the lucky things, he was able to retire quite young.

[00:15:09] So he retired at 49.

[00:15:10] Oh, wow.

[00:15:11] His always dream was to retire at 50.

[00:15:13] And one day he came home from work and said, that's it.

[00:15:16] I've had enough of having my notice in and they'd already bought a place in Spain that oddly they trusted me to look at.

[00:15:22] Okay.

[00:15:23] I was out there on holiday and they said, can you go have a look at these properties for me?

[00:15:27] And looked at sort of two of them.

[00:15:29] So he said, out of the two, which one would you buy?

[00:15:32] And I said, well, I think I'd probably have this one.

[00:15:34] And he picked me up from the airport after about a week or so.

[00:15:38] And he said, oh yeah, we bought it.

[00:15:40] I might say so.

[00:15:41] It was quite a big, and they had 25 years there and they were incredibly happy.

[00:15:46] So it's a lovely place.

[00:15:47] And sadly, my dad and his partner, Gene, they're both gone now.

[00:15:51] But they had a lovely, lovely, lovely life out there.

[00:15:54] You obviously put the faith in your ear after you chose the Peugeot so well.

[00:15:57] Yeah.

[00:15:59] But oddly, after loving Peugeots for so long, when he went out to Spain, he had Renault Twingos,

[00:16:05] which we didn't get over here in the first generation.

[00:16:07] No.

[00:16:08] He had one when he first got out there.

[00:16:09] And then when my grandma died and he got some inheritance, he bought a brand new one, a

[00:16:14] Twingo Privilege in metallic red, which was top of the range back then in Twingo land.

[00:16:19] And it was a brilliant little car.

[00:16:21] So much space.

[00:16:22] It had a seat that you used to be able to roll backwards and forwards in the back seat.

[00:16:26] Okay.

[00:16:27] So you had leg room like a limousine in the back and a small boot.

[00:16:30] Oh, nice.

[00:16:31] Yeah.

[00:16:31] Which most of the time he didn't need any boot space.

[00:16:33] Is this the car that's kind of like a Clio sort of size?

[00:16:37] Yeah.

[00:16:37] It's like...

[00:16:38] Like the Clio's cousin.

[00:16:39] Yeah.

[00:16:40] It's slightly smaller than the Clio.

[00:16:42] And it must have gone on sale probably early 90s, 93, 94.

[00:16:47] A bit like the K8 of the Fiesta, wasn't it?

[00:16:49] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:16:50] It was sort of the trendy cousin.

[00:16:52] Yeah.

[00:16:53] They didn't do it in right hand drive, so we didn't get it.

[00:16:56] But it was an awesome car.

[00:16:57] It really was.

[00:16:58] And the first one he had, he didn't even have power steering.

[00:17:02] He had air conditioning, but no power steering.

[00:17:04] And then the second one had electric everything and the air con.

[00:17:07] And it was a really, really lovely car.

[00:17:09] I really should, when my dad passed away, we sold it for something like 250 quid,

[00:17:15] really cheaply to get rid of it.

[00:17:16] I should have brought it back to England.

[00:17:18] I really should have done.

[00:17:19] I could have driven it back and it would have been absolutely awesome.

[00:17:22] But we just didn't think of that.

[00:17:25] But yeah, it was an absolutely brilliant car.

[00:17:27] They should have sold it here.

[00:17:28] And then they sold the second generation one.

[00:17:30] It didn't really sell that well.

[00:17:31] Yeah.

[00:17:32] I remember the revamp, as you say.

[00:17:34] And I don't remember seeing many of them around, but it did look like quite a nice

[00:17:37] little quirky thing.

[00:17:38] Yeah.

[00:17:39] Yeah.

[00:17:40] And Renault has really started getting their mojo back now.

[00:17:43] They're doing some really, really good cars.

[00:17:46] So that's really good to see.

[00:17:47] It's funny how car makers seem to go in waves where they do have really good times.

[00:17:51] Like in the past Ford have been brilliant.

[00:17:53] And now they're kind of in the doldrums a little bit where they don't do the Fiesta anymore

[00:17:57] and they're going to be getting rid of the Focus.

[00:17:59] And they sort of bet everything on electric, which is going down the cargo a little bit.

[00:18:03] It's funny to think that when these manufacturers do have these sort of changes,

[00:18:07] it's all basically because there's maybe like a handful of people that have come in or...

[00:18:13] Yes.

[00:18:13] It might even just be one person, might it?

[00:18:14] Yeah.

[00:18:15] That's kind of been quite dynamic and said, oh, let's do this.

[00:18:18] And everyone's bought into it.

[00:18:20] But you never really think about that, do you?

[00:18:21] You just see the end product or the mess.

[00:18:23] Well, Ford was transformed by one guy, really, Richard Barry Jones.

[00:18:29] And he really transformed the way that Ford's drove and how entertaining they are behind the wheel.

[00:18:35] Okay.

[00:18:35] And he really transformed Ford.

[00:18:39] Sadly, he died a year or two ago in an accident, but he was really transformative.

[00:18:45] But yeah, no, you're right.

[00:18:47] It is just down to a few people sometimes.

[00:18:50] Yeah.

[00:18:51] How things are.

[00:18:52] It could kind of be a domino effect as well, kind of, on the other brands.

[00:18:55] Yeah.

[00:18:55] That will end up sort of copying or reworking things in a similar way.

[00:18:59] Yeah.

[00:19:00] Right.

[00:19:00] Ford really, beginning to make their cars steer really nicely and handle well.

[00:19:06] There wasn't that focus on how cars performed.

[00:19:10] You kind of wanted a car to get you from A to B.

[00:19:12] Yeah, yeah.

[00:19:13] But the Fiesta facelift in about 95 was the first one that really set the world alight

[00:19:19] and making it feel really good behind the wheel.

[00:19:22] Yeah.

[00:19:22] In comparison, the Vauxhall Corsa was a dog to drive, really.

[00:19:26] And then gradually all the rivals sort of caught up.

[00:19:30] And then things like the Peugeot 205 was really renowned for being absolutely brilliant to drive.

[00:19:35] But that wasn't followed up with the 206, which was quite mediocre.

[00:19:38] It's funny.

[00:19:39] They do have hits and misses.

[00:19:41] Mm.

[00:19:41] Going back to Peugeot's and the styling, and Pin and Farina were designing like the 205 and the 405 and the 605.

[00:19:48] And then they do the 309, which looked pretty awful.

[00:19:51] And that was because it was originally supposed to be a Talbot.

[00:19:54] Okay.

[00:19:54] Interesting.

[00:19:55] And they changed it at the last minute and it was going to be called the Talbot Arizona, which would replace the horizon.

[00:20:01] Okay.

[00:20:01] But they decided that they were going to get rid of the Talbot name around the world.

[00:20:05] So they quickly had to think, oh, what are we going to do?

[00:20:08] We'll call it a Peugeot.

[00:20:09] Oh, okay.

[00:20:09] So it wasn't really a proper Peugeot.

[00:20:12] And then they got to come up with a name.

[00:20:14] Well, we've got the 205.

[00:20:15] We've got the 405 coming.

[00:20:17] What should we call it?

[00:20:18] We call it a 305.

[00:20:19] Ah, we've got a 305 already.

[00:20:20] What do we call it?

[00:20:21] So they called it the 309.

[00:20:23] It's funny, isn't it?

[00:20:24] Yeah, it really, really is.

[00:20:26] But yeah, the 309 didn't look particularly attractive.

[00:20:29] But there was a Goodwood version, wasn't there?

[00:20:32] It was nice.

[00:20:32] Yeah, it was.

[00:20:33] Goodwood GTI.

[00:20:34] Really nice.

[00:20:35] In Goodwood green and...

[00:20:36] Beachwood steering wheel.

[00:20:37] Yeah.

[00:20:38] I think.

[00:20:38] Yeah.

[00:20:39] And the charcoal coloured aloes.

[00:20:41] I would love one of those.

[00:20:42] There can't be many left.

[00:20:44] There are very few that aren't either.

[00:20:46] It'd been in an accident or original or...

[00:20:49] I think there's, well, probably a handful now.

[00:20:52] I would absolutely love one of those.

[00:20:55] I think when I passed my test,

[00:20:57] I've been driving for the best part of a year or so.

[00:20:59] I think it was on eBay and as you do.

[00:21:01] I always remember seeing one that was just constantly there

[00:21:04] being relisted for nothing really.

[00:21:06] Yeah.

[00:21:07] The other one that I'd really love of that kind of era

[00:21:10] is they did a 205 STDT, they called it.

[00:21:15] And it was a diesel GTI.

[00:21:18] So a three door.

[00:21:18] Oh, right.

[00:21:19] That's had the 205 GTI body kit.

[00:21:22] All of the...

[00:21:23] It was well specified, but it had 405 alloy wheels on it.

[00:21:28] Oh, okay.

[00:21:29] And they also did another version called the Gentry beforehand,

[00:21:32] which was a 1.9 automatic, which was detuned.

[00:21:37] And they both looked the same, but I'd love the diesel version.

[00:21:41] That really had a really good reputation for being economic on pretty quick.

[00:21:46] I bet it's one of those diesel engines that probably just goes on and on and on, isn't it?

[00:21:50] Oh, yeah.

[00:21:50] Yeah, that XUD diesel engine was just bulletproof.

[00:21:54] So in comparison to some diesel engines nowadays where you've got DPF problems

[00:21:59] and everything else, you just could run it and run it and run it.

[00:22:02] You run it on chip fat and it wouldn't object.

[00:22:05] Exactly.

[00:22:06] What was your mum's choice of cars?

[00:22:08] Once she'd kind of split for your father, what was she driving around in?

[00:22:11] Well, she bought the Chrysler Sunbeam as part of the divorce settlement.

[00:22:15] Okay.

[00:22:16] So that was her first one.

[00:22:17] And I jokingly said to her, get a green one.

[00:22:20] Because everybody hated green cars back then.

[00:22:23] And she came back with a meadow green, which is really, really quite bright.

[00:22:27] The Sunbeam 1.3 LS.

[00:22:29] So she had that for quite a few years.

[00:22:31] And then when my granddad passed away, she then had his Ford Escort in bright yellow,

[00:22:37] which was lovely.

[00:22:39] It was a lovely car that was.

[00:22:41] What were we talking there?

[00:22:42] Mark III, Mark IV Escort?

[00:22:43] It was a Mark II.

[00:22:45] Ah.

[00:22:45] Okay.

[00:22:46] Yeah.

[00:22:46] So it was an N registration, 1975.

[00:22:48] Like a lemon in that shape.

[00:22:50] Yeah.

[00:22:51] Yeah.

[00:22:51] It was a 1.3L and good, honest car.

[00:22:55] And he'd bought that.

[00:22:57] And then my mum drove it home.

[00:22:59] In fact, the first time she'd ever driven in London was driving back from where they lived

[00:23:04] in Fulham.

[00:23:04] And she bought it home and she'd never driven in London and didn't know her way.

[00:23:08] And yet she said, it felt like my dad was sitting beside me telling me where to go.

[00:23:12] And yeah, so we had that.

[00:23:15] And then what did she buy?

[00:23:16] Oh, that's right.

[00:23:17] Then they sold that and they bought Cortina.

[00:23:19] And then a Nissan Sunny.

[00:23:21] Because my grandma, she always used to have Nissan Cherries.

[00:23:25] So they thought they were always reliable.

[00:23:27] So I had that.

[00:23:27] Fair enough.

[00:23:28] And then they had a Rover 214 SI, which just to get one up on them, I bought a 214 SLI.

[00:23:35] That was my second car.

[00:23:38] And theirs didn't have power steering.

[00:23:39] Mine had a power steering and an electric sunroof.

[00:23:41] It's funny, like the era of the Cherry and the Sunny.

[00:23:45] That predominantly must have been bought by early people, mustn't it?

[00:23:49] Yeah.

[00:23:49] I don't know what that change was to get the market over to a younger sort of target audience.

[00:23:55] It just always seemed to be old people driving those cars back in the day.

[00:23:58] Yeah.

[00:23:58] Yeah.

[00:23:59] She had the old Cherry 100A.

[00:24:02] And she bought a brand new one, 83, wire registration, which was doomed.

[00:24:08] Everyone seemed to reverse into the car park and it had orange stripes down the side on a piece of trim.

[00:24:14] And when she had it repaired the first time, they couldn't get hold of the trim as the car was so new.

[00:24:19] It was within the first couple of weeks.

[00:24:20] It was.

[00:24:20] So for about six months, she had no trim down the side of the car.

[00:24:23] So it was all mismatched.

[00:24:25] And the neighbor opposite reversed into the back of it and the side.

[00:24:29] And yeah, it's just one of those cars that tracks damage.

[00:24:33] But yeah, it was incredibly reliable.

[00:24:35] In fact, she used to lend it to me when I first passed my driving test.

[00:24:38] And I got my first speeding ticket in the Nissan Cherry.

[00:24:42] On day two of coming home from work, I got caught in a speed trap.

[00:24:47] I know.

[00:24:48] Which wasn't great.

[00:24:50] But yeah, that was a brilliant car.

[00:24:53] It really was very reliable.

[00:24:55] Any memorable cars that maybe your neighbors had or maybe other parents of school children, that sort of thing?

[00:25:02] I can always remember my best friend at school.

[00:25:05] I was always really impressed.

[00:25:07] Because his dad worked at Ford's and he had a Cortina estate.

[00:25:12] And they had this car for years and years and years.

[00:25:15] And his dad went out and bought a brand new car and he bought a Sierra LX.

[00:25:18] And it was one of the first ones with the two-tone paint.

[00:25:21] Okay.

[00:25:22] The gray paint on the bottom.

[00:25:23] And I was really impressed with that.

[00:25:24] It really, really stood out.

[00:25:27] Yeah.

[00:25:27] And I don't know why, but I always thought that the cars we always had at home were always old.

[00:25:32] But they were never more than about three or four years old, which was really, really quite odd.

[00:25:37] But I always thought that our cars were kind of inferior.

[00:25:40] But they weren't at all.

[00:25:42] They were great.

[00:25:43] Yeah.

[00:25:43] And then my next door neighbor, he used to drive a crane.

[00:25:48] And he used to bring it home and park it in the car park right at the end of the road.

[00:25:52] Wow.

[00:25:52] And it always used to be funny.

[00:25:54] And another one of the neighbors, he used to drive a coach for some of the time.

[00:25:59] And he used to bring that home from work and park it in the car park.

[00:26:02] So we used to have all sorts.

[00:26:05] And there was a man who lived in the flats opposite who had a Fiat 126.

[00:26:09] Okay.

[00:26:09] And you used to hear him come out and start it up in the morning.

[00:26:13] Then he swapped that for a Skoda Estelle.

[00:26:15] An A registration.

[00:26:17] So it must have been, what, 84.

[00:26:18] That was quite memorable.

[00:26:20] But...

[00:26:21] Old move getting a Skoda back then, wasn't it?

[00:26:23] It was.

[00:26:24] Yeah.

[00:26:24] Yeah.

[00:26:25] It was all still jokes with warm your hands as you're pushing it along and that sort

[00:26:29] of thing.

[00:26:31] Yeah.

[00:26:32] And the guy opposite, again, he worked for Ford's and I always remember him buying an

[00:26:35] Escort Eclipse.

[00:26:36] Okay.

[00:26:37] And even now, I still want one of those in Bahama blue.

[00:26:41] I don't want a flambeau red one.

[00:26:42] I want the Bahama blue.

[00:26:43] Yeah.

[00:26:43] They did them in blue or red, didn't they?

[00:26:45] Is that right?

[00:26:45] Yeah.

[00:26:46] It kind of looked like a five-door Escort XR3i, but with a 1.3 engine.

[00:26:52] Was it a Mark IV shape or Mark V?

[00:26:54] It was a Mark IV.

[00:26:55] It was kind of run out before the Mark Vs came out.

[00:26:58] Yeah.

[00:26:58] It was just really nice with a rear spoiler and it had the XR3i wheel trims and front fog

[00:27:05] lights.

[00:27:05] And yeah, it really looked good.

[00:27:07] And again, there's only a handful of those left now.

[00:27:09] But yeah, I always fancied one of those.

[00:27:12] Hmm.

[00:27:12] And one of the other neighbours had a Cavalier Commander.

[00:27:15] Okay.

[00:27:16] Great names, aren't they, of this era?

[00:27:46] Yeah.

[00:27:47] We've got X amount of Escorts.

[00:27:49] So let's just stick a coach line down each one and put a bit of trim on all that.

[00:27:53] Add a sunroof.

[00:27:54] Yeah.

[00:27:55] Yeah.

[00:27:55] Put some metallic paint, sunroof and some coach lines.

[00:27:59] And yeah, that's your special edition for the year.

[00:28:01] A bit like when you get a run of like orange Kit Kats or something.

[00:28:05] You used to get them, didn't you?

[00:28:05] Yeah.

[00:28:06] Petrol stations.

[00:28:07] Yeah.

[00:28:07] Probably Kit Kats going out of date or something like that.

[00:28:10] Yeah.

[00:28:11] So let's just stick a bit of orange in.

[00:28:12] What are we going to do with the brown metro we've got in the backyard?

[00:28:16] Let's just put some wheel trims on it and some stripes and...

[00:28:19] Vandam plant.

[00:28:20] Job done.

[00:28:21] Yeah.

[00:28:22] Yeah.

[00:28:22] Then there was Vauxhall who brought out the course limited edition, which actually wasn't

[00:28:27] limited at all.

[00:28:28] And they sold more limited editions than anything else.

[00:28:31] Another one that does a lot of this is Sensodyne toothpaste.

[00:28:35] Oh yeah.

[00:28:36] There's one in particular that we get and there's millions of them, but they literally

[00:28:39] just come out of a new one every so often, like extra whitening or something.

[00:28:43] Yeah.

[00:28:45] It's a minefield, but you want the one that, you know, does the job, but you end up getting

[00:28:48] the wrong one.

[00:28:49] It's like, oh, £4.80 down the drain.

[00:28:51] Yeah.

[00:28:51] Quite literally.

[00:28:52] Yeah.

[00:28:54] It's funny.

[00:28:55] We don't get all that these days for the special editions.

[00:28:58] I used to love that.

[00:28:59] We're catchy advertising, TV advert.

[00:29:03] The Peugeot 106 Key Largo and Key West.

[00:29:06] They will get a Tesla full moon or something sooner.

[00:29:09] Yeah.

[00:29:10] And then they did the tie ups with rock bands, didn't they?

[00:29:13] Because Volkswagen had like the Bon Jovi.

[00:29:16] Yeah.

[00:29:16] They did a Rolling Stones.

[00:29:17] Yeah.

[00:29:18] And then, yeah, Peugeot did Quicksilver, didn't they?

[00:29:21] Yeah.

[00:29:22] And Renault did Billabong.

[00:29:23] Is that right?

[00:29:23] Yeah, I did.

[00:29:24] Yeah.

[00:29:24] I forgot about that.

[00:29:25] Yeah.

[00:29:26] Volkswagen did Fender, didn't they, with the new Beetle more recently?

[00:29:30] I did.

[00:29:31] Yeah.

[00:29:31] Peugeot, of course, for a long time was Roland Garros.

[00:29:34] That's right.

[00:29:35] Yeah, yeah.

[00:29:36] Yeah.

[00:29:36] Now Renault, dude.

[00:29:38] So we're now going to get Renault Roland Garros.

[00:29:40] Oh, really?

[00:29:41] The new Renault 5 that comes out in the spring, there'll be a Roland Garros version of that.

[00:29:45] And that just sounds completely wrong.

[00:29:47] It shouldn't be.

[00:29:48] Only Peugeot can have a Roland Garros.

[00:29:50] Yeah.

[00:29:51] And like Ford with the Orion 1600e.

[00:29:54] Yeah.

[00:29:54] The real luxurious one and the 2000e Sapphire.

[00:29:59] They were really nice.

[00:30:00] But the 1600e Orion's so rare now.

[00:30:03] Yeah.

[00:30:03] They really are.

[00:30:05] But yeah, they're all awash everywhere.

[00:30:07] They're back in the late 80s when they were brand new.

[00:30:10] Yeah, a bit of a rep's favourite.

[00:30:11] Yeah.

[00:30:12] Just one of those ones that no one would have thought to have kept going really, isn't it?

[00:30:16] Yeah.

[00:30:16] But now when you look back, you think, oh, that's quite a nice car now.

[00:30:19] Yeah.

[00:30:20] We had proper wood cap doors and wood trim inside.

[00:30:23] It wasn't cheap veneer or plastic or anything.

[00:30:26] It was all properly done by the coach builders put it all in.

[00:30:30] So it was really, really lovely.

[00:30:32] Yeah, I was loving the Orion 1600e.

[00:30:34] The trouble is, I'd go around buying everything up and just storing it.

[00:30:38] Get rid of some of those magazines in first.

[00:30:40] Yeah.

[00:30:40] Yeah.

[00:30:41] Well, I would actually like to buy a car from the sort of 80s or 90s.

[00:30:46] I've been looking at Peugeot 405s and one of my colleagues has just bought one and he changes his cars quite regularly.

[00:30:53] So I'm thinking to myself, he'll probably change that in about five or six months time.

[00:30:57] So, you know, I might buy that from him.

[00:30:59] You have to start sort of fluffing him up, won't you?

[00:31:01] Just sort of planting the seed of, it's time to get rid of that one.

[00:31:03] Yeah, I do know of another one.

[00:31:06] There's a guy who's a Peugeot fanatic and he's got a cherry red GTDT that he keeps saying he's going to sell.

[00:31:14] But yeah, one of the two I'd quite like, but it needs to be garaged.

[00:31:17] And at the moment I can't because I've just got rows and rows of Ikea bookshelves with brochures literally floor to ceiling.

[00:31:24] It's a fireman's worst night, man, this.

[00:31:26] Yeah.

[00:31:29] So now I'm gradually getting rid of them on eBay.

[00:31:33] Oh, yeah. Okay.

[00:31:34] Yeah.

[00:31:34] They go for a decent price if you spend the time doing a really good description that's really informative.

[00:31:40] You can actually get some good money for brochures even now.

[00:31:43] Interesting.

[00:31:43] But these are really strange ones that seem to sell for good money.

[00:31:47] Like somehow, I don't know how, but I managed to end up with 17 VOL 850 brochures all of the same edition.

[00:31:54] I don't know how I did it.

[00:31:55] These sold quite a few years ago now.

[00:31:57] And there was loads of bids.

[00:31:59] First one went for £47.

[00:32:01] Nice.

[00:32:01] And I managed to sell six or seven of them as second chance offers.

[00:32:05] Right.

[00:32:05] And I think out of the six brochures that I sold on that time, I got something like 200 quid for just a specification guide brochure.

[00:32:13] Fantastic.

[00:32:14] And it's really, really odd.

[00:32:15] It obviously just hit a call, but all you need is two or three people wanting the same thing and the price goes to the roof.

[00:32:21] Yeah.

[00:32:21] But yeah, nowadays I tend to sell them for fixed prices.

[00:32:24] It's a bit more reliable.

[00:32:25] Yeah.

[00:32:26] It's nice if you've got kind of, yeah, a nostalgic vehicle that you can kind of pick something like that up, which sits on the parcel shelf or whatever when you go to an event and adds to the whole history of it, doesn't it?

[00:32:36] Yes.

[00:32:37] Yeah.

[00:32:38] Yeah, exactly.

[00:32:39] Gradually get rid of them.

[00:32:41] Well, yeah, I think that's a nice little place to leave it, I think.

[00:32:44] Brilliant.

[00:32:45] Thank you very much.

[00:32:46] Thank you very much.

[00:32:47] I mean, yeah, good fun.

[00:32:48] There was a lot of cars in there.

[00:32:49] Yeah.

[00:32:50] Yeah.

[00:32:51] Oh, yes.

[00:32:52] Thank you for inviting me.

[00:32:53] That's been good fun.

[00:32:54] So, where can people find you guys?

[00:32:56] You're in the shops?

[00:32:58] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:32:58] In the high street.

[00:33:00] So, W Smith, news agents, motorway service stations, airports.

[00:33:05] Okay.

[00:33:06] All the usual suspects.

[00:33:08] And we're available online at www.classicretromodern.com.

[00:33:14] Cool.

[00:33:15] Thank you very much for joining us, Ian.

[00:33:16] Cheers, Ian.

[00:33:16] Thank you very much.

[00:33:18] Bye-bye.

[00:33:19] Bye-bye.

[00:33:19] Bye-bye.

[00:33:20] Bye.

[00:33:20] That was a bit of fun, wasn't it?

[00:33:21] Yeah.

[00:33:22] Yeah, nice.

[00:33:23] What a run of cars.

[00:33:24] Yeah.

[00:33:25] Yeah, I guess cars that would have often been overlooked.

[00:33:28] I've never had any dealings with Simcas.

[00:33:29] No.

[00:33:30] And the old Talbot Chrysler things.

[00:33:33] I think we went to look at a Talbot of some description many moons ago, but I don't

[00:33:39] think we bit the bullet on it.

[00:33:40] I think we left it.

[00:33:41] It's probably for the best, but...

[00:33:43] As in your parents.

[00:33:44] Yeah, yeah.

[00:33:45] Sorry.

[00:33:45] Yeah, yeah.

[00:33:46] Trying to think what sort of year that would have been.

[00:33:48] That would have been in the 90s because we were buying cars that were 10 years old at

[00:33:51] least.

[00:33:52] So yeah, we wouldn't have been buying a new one, but yeah, what a run.

[00:33:57] Yeah.

[00:33:57] Decent sort of knowledge of...

[00:34:01] What's the word?

[00:34:02] Special edition vehicles for me as well.

[00:34:05] Yeah, yeah.

[00:34:06] I guess, yeah, given his pastime of collecting brochures.

[00:34:10] Yeah, yeah.

[00:34:11] You'd kind of expect that and then you had to fill a garage full of brochures and have

[00:34:15] 50,000 PDFs on record.

[00:34:17] Jesus.

[00:34:18] It'd be interesting to have a flick through those just to see kind of how many of them

[00:34:22] you'd kind of consider of use and how many of those are so obscure.

[00:34:26] Yeah.

[00:34:26] Peculiar.

[00:34:27] But I suppose in his line of work, if you're producing a car magazine, which is along those

[00:34:30] lines, that's gold dust, isn't it?

[00:34:32] Like you can't find that anywhere else.

[00:34:34] I reckon a third of those PDFs have got to be duplicates because they always open three

[00:34:37] or four times, don't they?

[00:34:38] When you click it.

[00:34:41] They've just got a little one and a two in brackets next to the phone.

[00:34:44] Yeah.

[00:34:45] Brackets galore.

[00:34:46] It's not opening.

[00:34:47] Six PDFs.

[00:34:50] His computer's weeping like some sort of asthmatic marathon runner.

[00:34:55] Oh, memory again.

[00:34:56] Yeah.

[00:34:57] It's the Toyota Hi-Ace this time.

[00:34:59] Damn it.

[00:35:01] No wonder he had 17 Volvo manuals.

[00:35:04] Yeah.

[00:35:06] Yeah.

[00:35:06] Every time he went in there, just grab another one.

[00:35:08] Yeah.

[00:35:08] But yeah, good little chat.

[00:35:10] Good to support printed media, I think.

[00:35:13] Definitely.

[00:35:14] Yeah.

[00:35:14] There's some cool sort of specialist car magazines around.

[00:35:17] I think we said before, we sort of can't beat that really, like actual tangible car

[00:35:22] stuff in a way, like magazines and stuff.

[00:35:24] I don't think it's something that's ever going to really die, is it?

[00:35:27] It's always going to be there, I think, because there's enough people that still want it.

[00:35:31] I think, yeah, the cream rises to the top, doesn't it?

[00:35:33] As I say.

[00:35:34] And we've been through kind of an era where cost has been really important.

[00:35:39] Probably, I don't know, 10 years ago when people were printing magazines left, right

[00:35:42] and center on rubbish paper, just banging them out because people would buy anything.

[00:35:46] Mm.

[00:35:47] And yeah, I guess these days people are a little bit more conscious, but they are prepared

[00:35:51] to pay for kind of a quality product.

[00:35:53] So, yeah, something that maybe is a little bit less frequent, but you're perhaps paying

[00:35:58] a tenner for it rather than five pound or whatever.

[00:36:01] Yeah.

[00:36:01] And it's sort of right in your sort of niche, your ballpark seems to be kind of where it's

[00:36:06] at.

[00:36:06] Yeah.

[00:36:06] So, yeah, I think that's really good.

[00:36:08] Well, yeah, thank you very much for joining us.

[00:36:11] All right, mate.

[00:36:11] We'll wrap it up.

[00:36:13] Roll the credits.

[00:36:15] Thank you for listening to My Dance Cart.

[00:36:18] I hope you enjoyed the show.

[00:36:21] Please support us.

[00:36:24] Buy us a copy and subscribe.

[00:36:28] And tell all your friends.

[00:36:30] Bye.